As thousands of women march on Washington, I believe the point they’re trying to make is, “Nobody likes you!”
Sure, you have to dig a little to hear that message…past the “pussy hats” and desecrated saints. You have to look past the I ❤ Abortion T-shirts and ignore phrases like “blow up the White House.”
But I think that’s the gist of what they mean.
“Trump (and the rest of his administration) can’t fix our problems.”
“He’s not popular.”
“None of us like him.”
And if I’m correct about that underlying message… well, then, okay! I agree!
Trump is pretty gross and weird and unpleasant.
Did you hear me?
I said, if you’re looking for a President everyone wants to be friends with, then Trump isn’t the guy.
Nobody likes him!
(Well, okay, there certainly are wing-nut supporters who put him up on a pedestal and claim he’s the key to America’s Greatness.)
But there are lots of people who voted for Trump that don’t worship him.
What you need to understand is: many, many of Trump’s “supporters” don’t depend on him to bring Hope and Change.
No, that would be a certain OTHER President we elected with great adoration and fanfare:
The word on the street is, Trump’s inauguration was attended by relatively few people, and that some were even paid to be there.
The size of the crowd in support of Trump, compared with the size of the crowd marching against him, has been brought up over and over again today.
Like here. And here. And here.
Critics keep reminding him:
“You’re not even popular!”
“Nobody likes you!”
And, because Trump hails from Reality TV land, where ratings and popularity are everything, he takes this personally. Whenever someone suggests that no one likes him, he feels the need to respond with “nu-uh, EVERYBODY likes me!” And then he makes silly claims, like beating Hillary in a “landslide.”
(It’s possible that Trump may have a slight ego problem.)
But, here’s the truth: Trump isn’t as popular as Obama. People don’t like him as much.
And, if I have to choose between a President that people don’t much like and a President that people worship, then I’m going to choose the guy we don’t like.
I know this is strange for Americans who are confused (as Trump is) and believe this whole election has been a long episode of Dancing with the Stars.
But we’re not supposed to be hiring a celebrity. Politicians aren’t meant to be objects of worship.
The President shouldn’t be an American Idol.
So, yes, women who are marching to tell Trump he’s a loser… You’re right.
He has bad hair.
He says stupid, off-putting things.
And he doesn’t have NEARLY the fan club of the sex-symbol who left the office.
Obama won the office (twice) on a wave of childlike faith that he would rule with amazingness and make everything wonderful.
But–on the flip side–I hope Trump’s unpopularity will make him a better President than Obama ever was.
Conservatives want to keep the power of government small. We believe NO politician can fix our problems, because we must fix them ourselves. Most true Conservatives aren’t going to show up at an inauguration like it’s a U2 concert.
It’s hard to keep the government small when you’re obsessed with the Prez and wish he was your BFF.
So, I like this trend, America! Keep electing the people no one likes!
(And, for more reading on a similar topic, I wrote about Trump’s pick for Secretary of Education: the unpopular Betsy DeVos.)
Cultures at War 
I think the bloke is a complete dickhead – not unlike the vile arsehole in power down here.
It will be an interesting term of office.
I wonder if he’ll bring all your troops home?
That would be something to see.
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Unfortunately, politicians who are upstanding and full of integrity don’t make it in most Western countries. They are laughed at for being “inexperienced” and told they’re out of touch… If they talk about family values and strong morals, then they’re accused of trying to start a Theocracy. So, it’s kind of hard to find a good representative of the American people, when the people themselves are often corrupt.
This video challenged me earlier this week. I didn’t vote for Trump at the polls. But I’m part of a culture where we actually pay people to dance and sing dirty to us. We are what we consume:
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Can’t watch the vid.
I don’t know too much specifically about American politics but the couple of times I watched a video and read a couple of transcripts – can’t remember which so don’t demand evidence ;), Bernie wotsiface seemed a pretty decent sort.
I still can’t get my head around the fact that any party would nominate a bloke like Trump!
Boggles the mind.
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Okay, went to FB and watched it.
Yep … can’t fault the video one bit.
Spot on.
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We PAY for this stuff. We make excuses for this stuff. We eat it up when it’s on TV, and then we act shocked when it sits in the White House.
I would have voted for Austin Petersen:
http://reason.com/blog/2016/05/11/austin-petersen-the-conservatives-libert
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Not my cup of tea. Don ‘t agree with supposed pro-lifers.
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I’m shocked! 😉
But that’s a deal breaker for me.
Small government; protect tiny humans. That’s it! (Oh, except have some integrity/character, if possible.)
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I am not a particular fan of abortion. However, there really are only two choices for pro lifers-. Send society back to pre-legalization, and that will NOT stop women from seeking abortion.
And, if this should occur, it will never become a universal standard again, women will seek out countries (or states) that refuse to be dictated to by this sort of mentality or,
Accept this fact, and work tooth and nail towards discovering a contraceptive method that will prevent pregnancy until such time as children are wanted.
And please don’t fire back with abstinence, okay?
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I wasn’t planning to “fire back” with abstinence. But…now I’m curious… why shouldn’t I fire back with abstinence? 🙂
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Sorry … won’t indulge you.
Do you agree it would a much more productive avenue to take to find a much more effective method of contraception?
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You can find whatever form of contraception you want. But unless you forcibly remove the ovaries of women across the globe, you’re going to run into unintended pregnancies. The question is: do those tiny people who are conceived have rights?
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You mean does a fetus have rights?
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Person/fetus is the same thing. So yes, does a fetus have rights? That’s the question.
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No. It is not the same thing at all.
And whether I agree or not is not really the issue.
That’s for medical professionals to decide, and for legislators to back what they feel is the best evidence.
I have already stated I am not a great fan, but I do not consider myself to be in a position to dictate or determine what a woman should or should not do with her body.
The reality is that, abortion has been part of human culture since the year dot.
You are never going to prevent it from occurring so in reality, the only question is: are you prepared to push /back/ get behind a system of contraception (whatever that may be) that strives to be 100% effective or as close as one can get and can be administered in such a way that the incidence of abortion is reduced to almost zero?
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As I said, that’s the question. “Do tiny humans in the womb have rights? Or do they not?”
That’s the question.
And, infanticide has been around forever, too. It’s still barbaric and wrong to let a newborn die of exposure. Thankfully, most people agree and civilized societies have made that practice illegal. I will only vote for politicians who are working toward making abortion illegal, too. It’s unnatural and barbaric, and even though some women will continue to break the law, it should not be their “choice” to interrupt the natural process with an act of violence like that. 🙂
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Okay, I’ll play along.
I presume, as a mature woman, you have thought this through, so let’s start and see what the likely outcome would be should a staunch pro-lifer get elected to office.
We can take it as a given that abortion would be outlawed with immediate effect, thus it seems logical that a fetus will be deemed to have ‘rights’.I presume you agree with me so far?
Now, as we are agreed that, as it stands, women will always seek abortion for unplanned pregnancy, first up:
What do you think will be the likely outcome once abortion is criminalized?
Outline what you think will happen.
Next: As it is now a criminal offence what do you consider would be the major adjustments to the current laws?
Specifically what punishment do you believe should be deemed appropriate for the crime of seeking and having an abortion?
Let’s deal with these issues first.
Away you go …
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I’m not “playing” anything, Ark.
I’m not a lawyer and I didn’t major in criminal justice. I can’t even tell you what the process/procedure is NOW, for women like Andrea Yates who drown their own children.
My point is: it’s barbaric for women to kill their own children, for any reason. It’s gross. It makes women look like animals who can’t control their sexual urges or their desire to put themselves first. Ew.
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The anti abortion lobby is a major part of certain politicians campain agenda and you have just stated you would only vote for a pro lifer who will outlaw abortion.
Surely you have given this some thought over and above the usual emotional stuff.
For example: Would you (personally) consider a woman who managed to obtain an abortion in the US , where a fetus now has ‘rights’ (assuming abortion is now illegal) to have committed murder?
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I will only vote for politicians who agree that babies in the womb have a right to live. That way, I won’t be on the wrong side of history. (Society itself is moving in a Pro-Life direction. More than half of people believe there should be restrictions placed on abortion.)
When it comes time to determine the actual SENTENCE/PUNISHMENT for obtaining an illegal abortion, I think the “doctor” should get the heaviest sentence. Practicing outside a sterile, legal environment? Putting a desperate woman’s life in danger for money? That’s pretty bad! But, I don’t know all the steps that go into sentencing a criminal.
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Fine I accept this.
However, part of the process of outlawing abortion would naturally be the immediate closure of all clinics that performed abortion, or at least this part of the services offered in women’s health clinics would cease with immediate effect.
Thus, we can presume that abortions would only likely be performed by doctors who had been struck off the registrar.
This is, after all, the 21st century and not post war America and the back ally, drunk medic.
And I agree in such an instance the doctor/nurse should bear equal responsibility.
Now, I am not asking for your legal expertise as, like me, we have no training in this field.
I am asking if ( bearing in mind the new status afforded a fetus) you personally beleive the deliberate action of procuring and going through with an abortion should be considered murder?
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I don’t see why we’d have to close clinics–as long as they stop performing the abortions. They can still do pap smears and D&Cs (when a woman miscarries naturally or needs to have cells tested). The only thing I have a problem with is intentionally killing a child, before delivery, for the sake of convenience. That part isn’t complicated.
I think abortion doctors should be charged with murder–yes–because they know it’s wrong. A pregnant woman who has been lied to might be considered an accessory to murder, or whatever lighter charge is often given to accomplices who don’t actually pull the trigger.
Maybe?
Personally, I prefer talking with women one-on-one, so they no longer WANT to get abortions. No woman wants to feel like an animal who causes violence against her own child.
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I agree. This is what I wrote. Read the comment again.
While there are women who may be unsure of what they are letting themselves in for most are fully aware.
And with regard the criminality of the action, well, it takes two to tango, and
the doctor’s culpability is not greater than the woman who sought him/her out.
So, assuming all parties were fully aware of their actions, do you, personally, consider the action of abortion is murder?
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If a woman KNEW she was hiring a hitman to scrape the baby out of her body, even though it was against the law? Yes, she is compliant in a murder. (But the doctor pulled the trigger.) I have no idea how judges and juries decide sentences in those cases.
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I think you are going overboard with the rhetoric Amanda. Let’s just keep it simple shall we?
So we have established that (under the conditions already stated) you consider the act of abortion is murder.
next.
Do you believe that outlawing abortion would in any way deter women from seeking abortion?
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I’m glad you brought up rhetoric…
I’ve actually done pregnancy counseling in the past, and your claim that “most women know what they’re doing” is simply false.
Since you’re interested in testimonies, you might check out Silentnomore.com, which features stories by men and women who regret their abortions. A HUGE number of them say they were actively lied to by family members who didn’t want to help raise the baby and by healthcare “professionals” who wanted the money from the abortion.
Plus, many young girls I’ve spoken to ask, “How bad could it be, when it’s legal!” and that’s an understandable question. Teens and college students don’t believe their teachers and doctors and mentors would allow them to do something harmful…
So, will outlawing abortion deter women “in any way.” Uh, yeah. Duh.
As for rhetoric, I’m tired of the pro-Abort side dressing up the terms by saying “choice” and “reproductive rights” and “healthcare” and “bodily automony,” to make it sound better. (“Healthcare” sounds so nice, doesn’t it?) They’ll use whatever word or phrase necessary to cover up the horror of what actually happens in an abortion procedure. That’s why I don’t really care about criminal sentencing in a hypothetical future. I’m much more concerned with being honest with women NOW, so they can make the best choice…and the best choice will never be abortion.
Show them pictures! Improve the foster and adoptions systems. And we can even go ahead and keep using the term “fetus” instead of “baby,” if you want. (Fetus is Latin for “little one.”) But we should talk plainly instead of sugar-coating the procedure. The female body is meant to protect the Little One–not to allow metal forceps to pry her open and suck the little one out.
I like politicians who are honest about that.
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Sorry, you are right. My wording was not specific.
Most woman are likely unaware of what’s involved with the procedure.I was trying to establish intent.
So you believe that making abortion illegal will deter women from actively seeking abortion.
I might be inclined to disagree with this , but not being a woman,
I would not know how desperate she might get. And of course we would likely see a return to self-induced abortion
Oh, are you also against the morning after pill?
Would you still be fully behind a drive to develop a contraceptive as I mentioned in the opening comment?
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Yes–making abortion illegal will cause women to think twice, at the very least.
I have no problem with scientists trying to find a contraceptive which is more effective than the 95-98% accuracy of most contraceptives we currently have. But, because I care about WOMEN in addition to caring about their babies, I would have to be honest that there’s no such thing as safe sex, because all sex has consequences. Even if you take away the physical ability to get pregnant, there are emotional consequences.
Honesty is the key. 🙂
And, honestly, whether you like it or not, the BEST choice a woman can make is to be sexually active ONLY within a committed marriage in which both partners understand that (sometimes) surprises may happen.
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Illegal … yes I worked that out.
No, not whether” I like it or not”, it is not up to me to make that decision.
You did not answer whether you are okay with the morning after pill?
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Nope. A new human’s life begins at conception.
The Morning After Pill intentionally makes a woman’s womb a hostile place, so that a healthy blastocyst cannot implant where it naturally would have.
(Also–because I care about the woman as well as her baby–I would have to tell her honestly that synthetic hormones are nasty beasts. They wreak havoc on our bodies. I’ll never take the Pill again, let alone 3 pills at a time, which is what the Morning After pill is.)
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The problem I am having with this is your assumption that all women are dumb as lard.
I venture many women who might read your comments would object to your ”Mother Grundy”style.
I can presume therefore you would seek to have this pill made illegal as well then?
Do you consider its willful use also murder?
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I don’t believe women are dumb as lard. It’s just that not everyone has the time or interest in researching things on the biological level.
Plus, as I mentioned, there are people in the medical field and in the government who are actively lying about this stuff. Most doctors don’t have time to give ALL the ethical considerations to each patient in their 10 minute consults. And, many girls just assume that “legal” means “okay.”
So, yes, I’d like to see RU486 no longer an option for doctor’s to prescribe. But using it shouldn’t be classified as murder, yet. …at least not until people are much, much, much more educated than they are now.
Speaking of RU486, this is an interesting story. Yay, science:
http://www.lifenews.com/2015/11/04/doctor-saves-213-babies-after-the-abortion-has-already-started-wait-until-you-see-how/
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So you are say when people are educated it should be considered murder. Okay.
As you are educated about this do you consider its use to be murder?
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If *I* took “The Morning After” pill, in order to keep a fertilized egg from implanting, then–yes–it would be murder. It would be intentionally killing a unique human being, even though I know better.
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Okay. Fair enough.
Yet you are okay with the active prevention of fertilization?
You do not consider this ”wrong” in any moral sense?
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Preventing the sperm from reaching the egg isn’t necessarily wrong…
But, right and wrong is all about intent. Or, as religious people sometimes say, God looks at the heart.
Selfishness is always wrong. But empathy/putting-others-first is always good.
So, from that perspective, I understand why the Catholic Church is against contraceptives of any kind (other than cycle-planning). They believe that couples should have a higher purpose for their sex lives than just “getting off.” They argue that having tons of sex, without the possibility of giving new life, is basically mutual masturbation. It’s selfish in nature. Creating life is a privilege. It’s a GOOD thing–not a defect. Fertility is amazing, and sex is not just a fun past time.
But, personally, I don’t have a problem with preventing fertilization, per se.
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Okay.
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(That first line should have said ILLEGAL, by the way)
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Something you might find interesting regarding this topic.
A (very much so) Christian blog.
https://theway21stcentury.wordpress.com/2016/11/24/another-king/comment-page-1/#comment-6497
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Yes, I’m familiar with (and like) Unklee. And I tend to agree with this point in the comments:
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I was referring to the abortion comment …
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Oh.
Well, abortion wasn’t the main topic of the post originally, so I thought you were referring to “How different Christians select their vote” in general.
But–yes–it would be an interesting discussion to have with Unklee. My own father and I went round and round about what we thought the best selection would be this year, weighing everything including abortion. In the end, we voted for different people. But we both agreed that respect for life was a deal-breaker.
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Okay. Just thought you might be interested to read another Christian perspective, especially from Ignorantianescia.
This was the particular comment … in case you missed it.
Though I’m not amazed by it, the belief that restrictions on abortion and homosexuality should inform politics but Jesus’ teachings not is some remarkable, amazing hypocrisy. There is nothing biblicist about that level of cherrypicking, just rebellion against God (and I’m certainly no biblicist myself).
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My response to that would be: “I never make my arguments against abortion and homosexuality from a Pure Biblicist perspective.”
I believe there are natural clues that these acts are wrong, and EVERYONE (whether they identify as religious or not) has the truth of morality written on their hearts…
That’s why the group Secular Pro-Life is large and growing… This is one (Atheist) explanation of why abortion isn’t just a Bible-thumper’s issue.
http://www.secularprolife.org/abortion
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Actually abortion IS in the bible?
Are you saying you are unaware of it?
There is even an abortion ritual
Maybe you should refresh you memory, hmm?
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I didn’t say abortion wasn’t in the Bible.
I’m saying it’s possible to argue against abortion, without mentioning the Bible at all.
(But, yes, the Bible reports that humans have been killing their own children for quite some time.)
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I was referring to the abortion ritual in the bible as apparently sanctioned by your god.
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With all due respect, I’m not interested, Ark. 🙂
God did not “apparently” sanction abortion, except by those who “apparently” WANT to read such a conclusion into something…
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Of course you are not interested. And neither are a great many Christians who are often so blatantly ignorant of their own holy book and the commands of their god Yahweh.
There is no ”wanting to read anything into anything”. It is there, plain as day.
You do know what I am talking about, I presume, yes?
Christians have got Cherry-picking their religious dogma inside and outside their silly holy book down to an art form.
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Yes–I’m familiar with the Skeptic’s Annotated Bible. (I’m also familiar with Fundamentalists Christians, who ONLY read the King James version.) Both have the same problem: reading with an agenda.
But, it’s nice to see what you’ve been doing with your time since yesterday. 🙂 My advice: keep letting other skeptics tell you what the Bible says. It’s easier.
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I’ve known the biblical abortion ritual for a long time, dear.
Something you seem blithely ignorant of.
Maybe you should actually rad the bible yourself, sometime?
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And THIS is why I’m not interested. 🙂 Of course I’ve read the Bible. Multiple times, all the way through.
If the Bible says abortion is okay, then the Bible is wrong. (Everybody knows it’s wrong for them to take another person’s life.) So, if the Bible sanctioned abortion, it would be wrong. As I told JZ, burn it!…
Of course, only a hardened skeptic, grasping at straws, would read that section of Numbers that way. But there you have it.
I won’t say another word on the subject.
See ya next time! (And thanks for the link to Unklee. I left a comment there.)
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The passage is Numbers is clear enough.
And your god sanctioned it.
f the bible is wrong then your god is wrong … or maybe , just maybe this is in fact a man made ritual and your god is simply man made as well?
A long shot I guess but you never know, right?
Do you think it is at all possible that your god is simply a deity made up by a bunch of Bronze Age men?
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My Deity was DISCOVERED by a bunch of Bronze Age men…and has been described by millions of people, in a million different ways, since then. Each has it partly right, and partly wrong.
But we’ve been through this…
https://branyancomedy.wordpress.com/2016/09/18/why-we-cant-find-gods-bones/
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Not discovered, dear. Invented.
It’s in the bible …. read it.
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I don’t worship the Bible, Ark.
I know you want Theism to be a house-of-cards. You want to find a verse or two, somewhere, that you can “falsify,” so that you can throw the whole book out. But it doesn’t work that way.
I’ve read the Bible (multiple times, all the way through) and found it to be an accurate source of Truth in all the ways that actually matter. But, if you require it to be a straightforward, step-by-step rule book, then I understand why you’re frustrated.
Just burn it.
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I try never to destroy books, (being somewhat of a bibliophile) and especially works of fiction such as the bible. I have several editions for what it’s worth.One from Sunday School days.
It may seem an accurate source of truth to you, but this is no ways detracts from the fact that your god is simply made- up by Bronze Age men.
I can’t help it either if you don’t like this aspect of historical truth, but there you are. It’s in the bible.
Yahweh is simply part of a pantheon of made up gods. And he had a wife too.
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*yawn*
Bye, Ark.
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Truth hurts, eh? lol….
As a woman with women’s well being in mind I am surprised you don’t worship Yahweh’s missus, Amanda.
You know? Female solidarity and all that.
Sister doing it for themselves?
I mean, let’s be honest, Yahweh is a prick, isn’t he?
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